Zane Lowe - Kanye West. Zane Lowe. Full Interview lyrics

[Zane Lowe:] Grab a seat, grab a seat. So, you remember this place? Graduation? (It's cool, yeah). I was also thinking about some of the other things we've done as well with the BBC, like Abbey Road sprung to mind with the strings [Kanye West:] Oh yeah. That was good. That suit was like, I would've worn something different if I could look back right now. I could still do a suit, I just wouldn't have done that exact lapel situation [Zane Lowe:] But talk about really putting yourself on the line with that. That was so early on for you to be stepping in a room with that many players and that kind of – to give yourself that objective. What are your thoughts when you think back about Abbey Road, where…it's just nuts [Kanye West:] I thought it was good. I thought it was what I was supposed to do at that time. If I see something, if I see an opportunity, I'm gonna go for it. You know what I'm saying – We're all gonna die one day [Zane Lowe:] Yeah, that's true [Kanye West:] So live like that. Live like you could die tomorrow. Go for it. Those steps have been the, you know, the platforms that allowed me to make it this far [Zane Lowe:] And you have, man, and you're here. Six original albums of your own, a Throne record, various records with G.O.O.D. Music to talk about, man. But seriously, man, Yeezus. Bravo, dude. I mean, that is one of the most creative records of any genre I've heard in a very, very long time, and you know, just in terms of your output, your most exciting-sounding record, I think [Kanye West:] Oh, thank you very much. Yeah, I feel I was able to start making exactly what was in my mind again, not having to speak with the textures of the time. Cause, you know, Cruel Summer is definitely Kanye West, and there's something weird and kind of off about “Mercy,” like when it has the high-pitched, that type of sound. It sounds like art still a little bit, even thought it obviously was a radio smash But it's still – when I get into the idea, the trap drums and things like that, certain songs that are blatant radio hits, it's like I'm speaking with today's textures. And that's – if you look at it 200 years from now, it's not going to stand out in the way that 808's or Yeezus stands out, and can completely push or redefine or make people say, you know: hey, I completely hate that, or I completely love that, but let me just think differently. Because everybody is bound to these — no pun intended — they're bound to sixteen bars or eight bars, and you know the normal radio – the radio thing I was talking to Frank Ocean about this, and said, my mom got arrested for the sit-ins, and now we're more like the sit-outs. Like, sit off of radio, and say, hey radio, come to us. We need to find something new, because it's being controlled in a way, and manufactured in a way, that really awesome artists can make amazing music and not break as far past as, like, something that's very formulaic [Zane Lowe:] So it almost feels like a duty to you in a weird way? Having the peoples' ear, having peoples' attention for great music, to be able to say, well, if I'm not challenging them enough, I'm not challenging myself, not challenging radio, what am I doing? [Kanye West:] Yeah. I'm not trying to regurgitate myself. I showed – showed people that I understand how to make perfect. Dark Fantasy could be considered to be perfect. I know how to make perfect. But that's not what I'm here to do. I'm here to crack the pavement and make new grounds, you know, sonically and society, culturally [Zane Lowe:] You've done that with Yeezus. (Yeah) It's fascinating for us to sit here and talk about this record now, because normally when I talk to artists about records of this nature, it's in the lead-up to something. So we're all kind of playing a guessing game, you know what I mean? You could tell me what you think of the record, but I'm trying to find my way around it, the audience probably won't have heard it. In this case, it's been out for a minute, so we can reflect on it with the benefit of hindsight, too. You've seen what everyone else has had to say about this record, both good and bad. But I'm fascinated to know, today, how you would describe Yeezus, as someone who made it. How you would describe that record. You know? [Kanye West:] I just think that I'm a production person, I'm a product guy, I'm a producer. So if I'm working on a John Legend album, I'm gonna try to give John Legend the best home for him to stay in. And I'm gonna try to push Pusha T — no pun intended once again, this keeps happening to me — to make the thing that represents what I like about his music the most. And then for me as Kanye West, I gotta f** sh** up. (laughs) Ah-ha-ha! [Zane Lowe:] And you did, dude, seriously. From the minute it starts. I mean, seriously. (“On Sight” beginning plays.). It's disgusting So you're up in the loft probably at this point, and you're kicking around ideas, and you're putting things together, and this sound comes into your head, and you're like, this is what I'm looking for? [Kanye West:] Nah. This is me going to the studio with Thomas and Guy-Manuel, who's Daft Punk. They had a synthesizer the size of that wall right there. This is just one session right here. This beat was originally like 14 minutes long, and that part in the beginning was something we completely just distorted, and I ended up making that the intro [Zane Lowe:] You know, I got a beef with you over this track. It's too short! I wanted more out of it. Cause it's one of the best beats on the record for me, and it feels like you're just getting warmed up. Was that kind of deliberate, you know, to pull back after only a couple of verses and go, you know what, we're going to get on with the album now? [Kanye West:] Nah, it's just what I felt, like it should be [Zane Lowe:] [Just a dance thing] [Kanye West:] And you know, originally “Blood on the Leaves” was supposed to be first [Zane Lowe:] Wow [Kanye West:] Which, psychologically, I know would have changed certain Yeezus naysayers about the album. It wasn't that time for me. I – I – I didn't want to come up there and perform. A lot of times, music can be presented as a service position. But I wanted to take a more aggressive approach with music You know, people go on a vacation and say, you got the d**, you got the music, you got the wine? It's in that territory. But I wanted to speak up and say, okay, so my voice is only compressed to express myself artistically through music. It's the only place where I actually have a deal, so I can only consistently make things in music. So I'm gonna take music and I'm gonna try to make it three-dimensional, like – like – like on Star Wars and the hologram'll pop up out of R2D2. I'm gonna try to make something that jumps up and affects you, in a good or bad way. Whether it's, I'm going into a scream in the middle of the track because that's just the way I feel. But I'm not here to make easy listening, you know, easy programmable music [Zane Lowe:] No. You're so off the reservation on this album in the best possible way. Like you talked about, the way you use your voice in different ways, you don't rely on conventional rhyming flows. Your opening line, “Yeezus season approaching,” you know? “A monster's awoken.” You're laying it out there, this isn't My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy Part 2. I'm wilding out on this record, straight away (Interlude plays from “On Sight”). And then from nowhere as well, we just get treated to these wonderful moments where, like you say, it's almost like a collage. Like you're sitting here going, you know, why can't I go into this? Why not? [Kanye West:] You can [Zane Lowe:] And you did [Kanye West:] That's how life is. It's like a car crash. You could just be driving, and just out of nowhere it happens [Zane Lowe:] At what point did that very deliberate feel to the record, whereby breaks come in and join this really discordant electronic moments and everything seems to exist in this very – very contradictory but it works kind of way, at what point did that start to take shape? Because it is very omnipresent through the record as a whole, the way it flips between one and the other. Was that in your head early on, or did that come towards the end when you started to reduce the record? [Kanye West:] Well, I didn't reduce it. Rick Rubin reduced it. He's not a producer, he's a reducer. (Laughs) [Zane Lowe:] Nice – but was it always part of the process for you, to say, why don't I take elements of this and this and just (claps hands) bolt it together? [Kanye West:] Yeah. It's just the way I was consuming information in my life at the time. Negative information to positive information, from the Internet, just going to the Louvre, going to furniture exhibits and understanding that, trying to open up and do interviews with this, learning more about architecture. Taking one thousand meetings, attempting to get backing to do clothing and different things like that. Like, getting no headway whatsoever. It was just that level of frustration. This is what frustration f**ing sounds like This is what frustration sounds like. Like, for me, as Kanye West, I would not be Kanye West if it wasn't for Michael Jackson. I was with Quincy Jones a couple days ago at John Legend's wedding. Quincy was telling me, it wasn't just Mike, but these guys broke down the barriers. Of course you know Michael Jackson, he had to fight to get his video played because he was black. This is Michael Jackson. Michael Jackson's not even black, he's Michael Jackson — you know what I mean? It's like he's – he's so crazy, how can he even be cla**ified as this black artist? So for me, in my life and creativity it's been challenging yeah, it's been challenging and everything. But I was able to ascend to ma**ive heights because of the foundation that my mother and my father and my grandfather laid through civil rights, what Michael Jackson did with music videos and the ground he broke. There would be no Kanye West if it wasn't for Michael Jackson – that allowed him to be that, right? [Zane Lowe:] Ya [Kanye West:] Now let's take people who have issues with me as Kanye West. They cla**ify my motivational speeches as rants – like “Why is he saying that? Why is he doing that?” Well I've reached a point in my life where my Truman Show boat has hit the painting. And I've got to a point that Michael Jackson did not break down. I have reached the gla** ceiling – as a creative person, as a celebrity When I say that it means I want to do product. I am a product person. Not just clothing but water bottle design, architecture, everything that you could think about. And I've been at it for 10 years, and I look around and I say, “Hey wait a second – there's no one around here in this space that looks like me.” And if they are, they're quiet as f**! So that means – wait a second – now we're seriously in a Civil Rights movement. Like people used to joke about – remember our South Park photo – [Zane Lowe:] Yeah, I do [Kanye West:] Remember how funny that was? Do you think there would be a Givenchy in the hood if it wasn't for that South Park photo. But no one thinks about that – no one thinks about the names I got called for wearing tight jeans [Zane Lowe:] You reference that in the record, you talk about that. “No one's liked him since he's been wearing tight jeans.” Everybody knows you brought back real rap. I mean you reference that in the record [Kanye West:] I'm saying y'all had all that, but I brought real rap back. I'm going to do dope things. And I wanna take this opportunity to speak to something, because I go to Hypebeast sometimes to look it up, the new things that're coming out. And every time my name goes up, there's a series of people who write just negative comments – they wanna joke around and say, “Why is he still trying? Why is he doing this?” Why is he – they like diss me as a person for trying. Now mind you, I've brought 10 years of product that has added to humanity [Zane Lowe:] Ya [Kanye West:] You know, and now, what they don't realize when I say “Hey this is Pusha T, this is what it is” I have to remind Pusha T that he's Pusha T. Because the radio, if they're not playing a song of his that has an R&B hook on it or works at a certain level of trap tempo and plays in [club-live], it's like we forget about that Clipse album that meant everything And the reason why I relate it to design and what we do in design is saying that's the music that us as creatives that wanted to get into design – we looked at Clipse as the gods, and this is our soundtrack to creativity. And it's not a trap beat that comes in on that soundtrack to creativity. You know what I'm saying. No knock to trap, cause I did “Can't Tell Me Nothing” – I like it. But it's been commercialized to the point where – and I'm not mentioning no names – but what – but people used to use the term “R&B n***a” but then it was “rappers.” But then rappers didn't wanna be no R&B n***a. Now the rappers is the new R&B n***as! The rapper's the new radio! Like where's the culture at? Where is the culture at? So then I scream – and I'm sitting in the middle of it – whether I'm at a dinner with Anna Wintour, or you know, I'm at a listening session with Pusha, or me and Virgil are in Rome giving designs to Fendi over and over and gettin' our designs knocked down. Brought – brought the leather jogging pants 6 years ago to Fendi, and they said no. How many motherf**ers you done seen with a leather jogging pant? Meaning when I see Hedi Slimane and it's all like, “OK this is my take on the world” – yeah he got some nice $5,000 jeans in there, it's some nice ones here and there, some good sh** here and there But we culture. Rap the new rock n' roll! We culture! Rap is the new rock n' roll! We the rock stars! [Zane Lowe:] It's been like that now for a minute [Kanye West:] It's been like that for a minute, Hedi Slimane! It's been like that for a minute. We the real rock stars, and I'm the biggest of all of 'em. I'm the number one rock star on the planet [Kanye West:] We are the real rock stars, and I'm the biggest of all of them. I'm the number one rock star on the planet [Zane Lowe:] There it is. That record, it says that. That's what your album says when you come out, and there were songs on there, you make that very clear [Kanye West:] So what I want to explain to everybody out there, it's like, I make music I can do it, but I shouldn't be limited to only one place of creativity. And it's literally only like one or two or three reasons why I haven't been able to break that down [Zane Lowe:] But why would you feel that you are, because and I'm just… [Kanye West:] This is the thing you guys don't understand. You guys don't understand. You guys don't understand that I did the Yeezus and they eBay-ed it for $90,000 [Zane Lowe:] Right [Kanye West:] And people wanted them bad as whatever, right? But I didn't get a call from Nike the next day. You guys don't understand that I've met with companies and they say, “What we're trying to figure out is how we can control you and control that”. If you're a architect, if you're a world builder, if you have all these ideas and you're Gaudi, and you want to build buildings, if you don't ever get that out, what's going to happen? [Zane Lowe:] Isn't that why you do it? Isn't it the process? Isn't it the point to do it? [Kanye West:] I don't think you're really hearing what I'm saying [Zane Lowe:] But I'm trying to [Kanye West:] As a creative… [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] For you to have done something to the level of the Yeezus and not be able to create more and you cannot – you cannot create that on your own, with no support, with no backing. So when I say “clean water was only served to the fairer skinned” what I'm saying is we're making products with chitlins. T-SHIRTS! That's the most we can make! T-shirts. We could have our best perspective on t-shirts. But if it's anything else, your Truman Show boat is hitting the wall And what's more important to me about this than everything that I can do sonically and everything is, if I go somewhere and someone says, “Hey, we don't like Kanye West” you've heard that before, right? What people don't realize is I want to make uniforms for my high school basketball team through brand Yeezy. I want to make that one step, and then make another step, and then eventually do uniforms for the entire city Then I want those uniforms to be hot and make money and make – that I eventually want to be the anchor and the force behind a billion dollar company and after I make that billion dollar step, then I can go in and say, “Hey I've got an opinion on this and that could be a ten billion dollar step, and I eventually want to be the anchor of the first trillion dollar company But when you sit and you have a meeting with a company and show them the most innovative take on theatre because you thought of it one night while you're sitting on top of Watch The Throne set which you designed with Es Devlin, and I designed the set with Es Devlin and I thought of, okay, surround vision, there should be a screen above you, below you, to the left, to the right of you and front of you also. Then I paid my own money that I get paid for doing Gold Digger, which I never really liked that song but I always knew I would get paid for doing Gold Digger Then I shoot a film in Qatar with three camera crews, with Nate Brown, Virgil, Matt Williams, Nabil, all of these crew – all of the people that every video that pops up every other day on Hypebeast that's my crew, right? So, we go out and shoot that, three camera crews over five days, edited over 30 days, show it at amfAR – no, show it in Cannes, the night before amfAR on the beach, build it in a pyramid with Rem Koolhaas' agency, design the entire thing, put editors in it, blah blah blah, people give a standing ovation, I do an interview in New York Times the next year to say, “Hey, I did this and I want to let you know I did it”, right? [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] And then, it doesn't get mentioned in the interview and a week later they do an interview with George Lucas and Steven Spielberg and they're talking about what the next frontier of theatre will be and how it'll be higher priced tickets and it will be something that's surrounding you and blah blah blah, but maybe it's in the goggles, I said, “Wait a second, I just only did the interview to tell people that I invented it. I made it.” Like I went, I remember when I was, dropping William Morris, right, and then Sarah Newkirk at that time said “Before you drop them, go meet with Ari Emanuel” and I sat with him and I said, “Ari, I'm an inventor” and he goes on to tell me about the way it works and what he said is “You are a celebrity. So basically what's going to happen is, there's product here, and this is where you end up, right here. If you can communicate this product, you can make money off the product, because look at Gaga. She's the Creative Director of Polaroid.” I like some of the Gaga songs. What the f** does she know about cameras? So it becomes all of this thing where all of the musicians, the musicians try to get more money by promoting other products, right? So you'll say “Hey, you know what? I've got this water and we've got, you know, we've got this red version. We got a red bottle, and we've got a David Beckham version here, then we got a blue version.” So my opinion is no more than the patina on top of it, when I understand the reason from my core of why something should work all the way through So, I understand we want to make it about music but I wanted to take this step to say, we got this new thing called “Cla**ism”. It's racism's cousin. This is what we do to hold people back. This is what we do. And we got this other thing that's also been working for a long time where you don't have to be racist anymore it's called “Self-Hate”. It works on itself. It's like real estate of racism. Where, just like that, when someone comes up and says something like “I am a god”, everybody says “Who does he think he is?” I just told you who I thought I was, a god! I just told you! That's who I think I am! Would have been better if I had a song that said, “I am a n***a”? or if I had song that said “I am a gangsta”? or if I had song that said “I am a pimp”? All those colors and patinas fit better on a person like me, right? But to say you are a god? Especially, when you got shipped over to the country that you're in, and your last name is a slave owner's. How could you say that? How could you have that mentality? [Zane Lowe:] I mean, I know in the past you've talked about, like, you know, building hotels, doing things that are beyond people's normal frame of reference [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] They know you as Kanye West, an artist. They know that you're moving into fashion, but these things I guess in a way are hard for people to comprehend because they don't have that level of drive. Do you know what that mean? Has it always been like this for you? Have you always felt like you can set your mind to anything and you will achieve it, ultimately? [Kanye West:] I always felt like I could do anything. That's the main thing people are controlled by, thoughts, their perception of themselves. They're slowed down by their perception of themselves. If you're taught you can't do anything you won't do anything. I was taught I could do everything, and I'm Kanye West, aged 36. So just watch the next ten years [Zane Lowe:] Yeah, yeah, yeah [Kanye West:] One thing I want to express to people also, people think a lot of my motivation is very like megalomaniac, and self-oriented. To the contrary completely I just want to help, from day one, I just wanted to help Like my father was a black panther, my father was a journalist, a paparazzi, a photo journalist. He was a paparazzi. We had a dark room in our house. Like seven years ago, he lived in a homeless shelter, not because he was homeless because he wanted to help the ex-drug addicts. He wanted to get that close. He started a foundation called Good Water and moved to the Dominican Republic to help right there, to help with the prostitution, to help with the extortion, to help right there, he stays in Dominican Republic right now. My mom was the first black female chair of the English Department. There is no award show, there is no amount of Billboards, there is nothing that – that can define me or make me pa** what my parents made me. And that's exactly who I am. And I put on that pink polo and say broke, broke and broke through the TV and now you got to interview with me. Because their President who is coming out the gate, he was like it ain't going to work, but me I'm here. You know what I mean by I'm here like meaning like I got no play on Yeezus on a radio. Right, no [Zane Lowe:] No, not entirely true by the way [Kanye West:] A little bit but no number one records, no Kanye West, blah blah right. So then I was going back at forth, with the company I'm in touring right now. And I said I want to perform in the round and then creatively we just couldn't find it, so I said put me against the corner like how we did in Watch the Throne, well just do that instead. They said, well you know we just can't technically do it, because why, technically why. Why can't you do it? They said, look if you do that you are going to be in breach of contract, right. So basically meaning like if I didn't sell the tickets, I would go into debt [Zane Lowe:] Right [Kanye West:] So they pushed me – my back against the ropes, right and I said I'll take that chance. I'll take that chance right. So pre-order 9,000 the first day in Chicago doubling Watch the Throne, four pre-orders in one day. That made the people stood up said, we like what Kanye is saying. We like New Slaves [Zane Lowe:] But we do that all the time [Kanye West:] Yeah, but not through radio [Zane Lowe:] Well, yet but I'm a radio broadcaster and I love your records. I mean for me… [Kanye West:] No I'm not pin-pointing just you, I'm talking about the overall radio, there is no, “Get Lucky” on the album, and perhaps you know it's just because that just wasn't the song, and maybe it could be that, but it sounds like there's hits on that album to me. But it sounds like this hits that is distracted by the statements “f** you and your corporation, ya'll n***as can't control me” on the first single [Zane Lowe:] Yeah I mean this to me sounds like a radio hit where I'm coming from, but you said yourself back in the start, you made a record that was built out of frustration and then you were trying to create cracks in the pavement. I like that description more than you made an album for the radio hits. As a Kanye West fan, I don't turn to your … [Kanye West:] I never described it as an album for the radio hits [Zane Lowe:] No, no, no, what I'm saying like I preferred than you to describe it as cracks in the pavement than to have made a record just full the radio hits. You know what I mean, I want to hear where you are at [Kanye West:] Pause that, pause that. That song is a hit song, minus the line, “f** you and your corporation, ya'll n***as can't control me” on your first single [Zane Lowe:] I think it's a great record [Kanye West:] But you ain't hearing what I am saying [Zane Lowe:] Go ahead [Kanye West:] That song is a hit record minus, “f** you and your corporation, ya'll n***as can't control me, said on your first single. Because if you can't control me then you can't control him, then you can't control him, then you can't control him, and then the information age starts, where it occurs while I was talking about starts where Steve Jobs has left as starts. Steve Jobs made the internet usable. This is the information age, we barely scratched the surface [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] There is things that are moving. The entire music industry was hit by a f**ing glacier by the internet and Sean Parker, just like that glacier up in there, and Steve was like no, no, wait a second, come on, give him a little time. There won't be any music, if you just give it away like that. You know what I'm saying, but sh** it's changing. People are going to look at this interview and say, “Hey, I understand what he's talking about.” “People are going to look at this interview and say, ‘I don't like Kanye. Look, he looks mad. I don't like his teeth.' They're going to say, ‘Why doesn't he just focus on music? I liked him as music.' They're going to say, ‘Hey, I want the old Kanye, blah blah blah.' But one thing they will do, they will play this interview in five years. They will play this interview in ten years and say, he called that, he called that, he called that, he said that was going to happen, that was going to change [Zane Lowe:] You're a futurist [Kanye West:] Yeah. I'm a postmodernist, as best as a career. I'm a futurist, mentally [Zane Lowe:] Talking about the Internet where you feature into that. Obviously, it's just a small part of the future and being a futurist. It's not only just isn't aspect of it. It's changed the way everything moves, but it certainly with regards for music [Kanye West:] It's the biggest part. It's our earth. Like you remember like, that you see future movies and everything was in the sky, like it moved to the sky [Zane Lowe:] That's where it is [Kanye West:] That's the Internet [Zane Lowe:] Right [Kanye West:] That's what it is. That's our sky [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] That's our future sky. We kind of thought we knew it was in its flying cars. We didn't get flying cars, but we can send movies like in two seconds [Zane Lowe:] Yeah, it's a very good point. It's a very point [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] So you talk about it being in its early stages and it being really not even yet at a point where it's developed to its true potential. I mean, what are the key things that you've learned in your journey. I'm fascinated to go down this road for a minute if you want [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] We could talk about this because I'd love to [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] But while we hear… [Kanye West:] This record is just the codes of that. Go listen to all my music. It's the codes of self esteem. It's the codes of who you are? If you're a Kanye West fan, you are not a fan of me. You're a fan of yourself. You will believe in yourself. I'm just the expresso. I'm just the shot in the morning to get you going, to make you believe that you could overcome that situation that you are dealing with all the time [Zane Lowe:] Can I ask you a question about that? [Kanye West:] Yeah, yeah [Zane Lowe:] I want to talk to you about that aspect of your personality because you said that you're not here to be – talk about you – you're here to help, and I believe you, when you say that man. You know, I think, you know, you've given us great records. You'd like to think about where things are going to appear in the future. You keep your eye on things. You want to make like you said, you want to make basketball tops for you. If you're in high school, you want to do things right [Kanye West:] Yeah, yeah [Zane Lowe:] Do you allow yourself the time to be good to yourself? Do you allow yourself anytime for yourself at all? Do you know what I mean, I know you've got a good self esteem and who you are, but you seem to be doing a lot for the bigger picture, for everything that's moving around you [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] Do you give yourself time? [Kanye West:] Yeah, it's like family time. Yeah, it's what Kim gave me [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] She gave me everything. She gave me a family. She gave me a support system. She was in a powerful enough situation, where she could love me without asking me for money, which is really hard for me to find [Zane Lowe:] Yeah. What are the some other things you know, that you've learned about yourself since you became a family man? [Kanye West:] You know, I can't pinpoint that I don't have the answer right on me. I got to think about a little bit and give you a really good answer [Zane Lowe:] Okay, cool [Kanye West:] I've got a lock and loaded amount of information that I like to express on a very wide scale that I'll give you. But if you ask me a question like that I'll go back and think of it maybe I'll have an answer for you in a couple of days [Zane Lowe:] Okay. No problem, no problem [Kanye West:] Yeah. When you get other outlets, you can relax and give other outlets more breathing room, meaning like, okay. When I did the Coachella performance, I had 30 dancers on stage, modern performance artists and I had this lift, and I had the Roman wall and I had like the Celine shirt and above all this types. So when Jay told me to watch it, I always say I didn't want to use dancers of course. And I said, that's fine, because I was doing a fashion show in Paris. So I still had 30 girls on the stage, but you know, I still had these elements of the emotion [Zane Lowe:] You must have been recognized that wasn't to through anything either I mean, that was I mean this only what throwing was about that type of performance necessarily [Kanye West:] Um, what I'm saying is it's about what I want to make it about. This is my world [Zane Lowe:] But you're with Jay on this start. It is a collaborative project. It's not just your vision on throwing [Kanye West:] Yeah. So then I would have to separate my world, but still get to my world out to the fact that I had a fashion show. You see I'm saying, so it's like right now, people could say oh, he is frustrated, He is that. He is that. No, all I need is the breakthrough. The joint venture for of my clothing, same as Stella McCartney has, same as – I can name so many people. They have joint ventures of backing to be able to express themselves that way. Okay, bam! I need that – that outlet, and then, you'll get things closer to watch the throne. You get things closer to bound because obviously people – more people are adept to like ‘Blood on the Leaves' and ‘Bound' and ‘Watch The Throne', it's just more of an overall like happier vibe, right. But Jay is more realized than me meaning more of his dreams and hopes and aspirations from above has come true and hopefully, God willing, by the time I'm his age, that thing will happen for me also, and I'll be in that place of a more zenned-out place Even it's like I couldn't have done this album without Rick Rubin. I had to have a Zen master come in and say, okay. This is just what we're going to do. You don't realize I am so frustrated, like I am so frustrated. Like I am so – I've got so much, I want to give. I've got ideas on color palettes. I've got ideas on silhouettes and I've got a million people telling me, why I can't do it, you know that I'm not a real designer. I'm not this. I'm not a real rapper either. I'm not a real musician either, like I don't know how to play the piano. Like I'm a artist, I went to Art College. I went to Art College and was looked down like I'm soft because I like wore like Italian clothes You know I'm saying, when I'm rapping in front of camera and my pant is tight, trying to spit a verse for [cam]. You know, that's the same when I'm sitting there, you know, like sitting there at a fashion show. Like I'm there, because I appreciate Phoebe Philo; I appreciate Raf Simons. I appreciate Riccardo Tisci, and I look at them as my peers, as creative people who dedicate their entire life to making something better for the world Let me explain what anybody that knows a artist and you know someone that's giving that. If you know artist, there is only one thing you can say, give or ask them when you see them. There are two words “thank you”. There is no, why didn't you do this? Yo, I want that, what's up – that. No. We dedicate our entire life to making our current time in civilization better to adding something to the culture, and there is only two words that you can say, “thank you” [Zane Lowe:] Give us an insight to the fashion world though, what you've been going through there with that whole experience. The biggest challenge you've had clearly to get your vision across? [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] Well, be helping me [Zane Lowe:] Is that partly and please don't take this the wrong way I just mean this in for the process of conversation. Is that partly do you think because some of the people who are making fashion look at you and they go well, you say it yourself they dedicate their whole lives to one thing, you are exceptionally successful and gifted in this area. To move into the area, it's understandable, there is a human aspect of suspicion involved there because they are like “well, hang on a minute, this is our life”. So what is it you are trying to achieve there? Do you think it plays a part of that what's going on do you think? [Kanye West:] I've dedicated the past 10 years of my life to this. I spent 80% of my time working on this, and 20% of my time working on music. Why do you think this song n***as In Paris is called n***as In Paris, because n***as was in Paris, because I had a office and a small courtyard across the street from Colette, where I couldn't even find a good pattern cutter. That's why we were in Paris I put in the 10,000 hours. I've got a very particular, specific take on men's footwear. No one can say I cannot design or understand how to design, a guy's sneaker. When I was in fourth grade, I was drawing Jordans, when my mama couldn't afford them. I was drawing those Jordans, getting kicked out of cla** for drawing them And when I get that opportunity to work with Nike, I went to that emotional space and place of my life and said, what was it about that? What were the queues that I can add when I make the Yeezy's. You know, I don't have to do interviews. And I wasn't the one rapper that had the opportunity to do a shoe at Nike for no reason It means, it has to be another step. It means, it has to keep going. People didn't love the Yeezy's the way they did for no reason. Picture this, for me to do the Yeezy's and not have a joint venture backing deal with Nike, the next day would have been like if I made ‘Jesus Walks', I was never allowed to make a album. If Drake made his first mix tape and was never allowed to be signed, if 2 Chainz only have 1:16 and then, people say, why you mad? Do you know how many 60s 2 Chainz had in them? He did 100 features in one year, 100 [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] 100… [Zane Lowe:] Okay, so let's … [Kanye West:] …features [Zane Lowe:] Let's get to the solution Kanye, let's work out. How are you going to kick that door in as well? How are you going to get in to that world in you're way, in your terms? [Kanye West:] I'm not trying to get into that world. I'm trying to make a higher level of product for the real world because people say life is unfair and unless you're Kanye West, you know, this pretty girl that dates this soccer player, or your parents had money, you don't get to wear Versace all the time. And you hear it, we love Versace, Versace, Versace, Versace, Versace, Versace. We love Versace. Versace is the greatest designer of all time. We love Versace. But unless you set a point or you rap so good, and knock down so many doors to produce so much sh**, that you was able to actually get Dame Dash to give you a record deal because he was a producer, not because he liked your raps because he was a producer This because Dame knew it was up and he was downtown with the models and the artist and all that say yo, look at you, this kid got some talent. You are not affording Versace. The creators they want to connect with people. These artists, the clothing is on as they want to connect with people the same way that music gets to connect with people. But the fab, the cost of silk is too expensive and they won't lower their quality level. So I can spend 2 million on a record and give it out at a democratic – in a democratic way. They could spend all their time making the greatest dress in the world, and it's just impossible to hand-make that many Let me explain to you what a fashion office is like, right. Sometimes if you are working on a album once it gets down to the last moment, there is two or three people in the studio, a engineer, a manager, the artist, a label guy; saying the masters to do tomorrow. Okay, they do a day after tomorrow but let's get them in. It narrows down to that At a fashion office, you've had people who have dedicated their entire life to this that are working 12 people 15, 20 people interns coming in, working till 4 a.m. that night slaving to be able to put that thing on the run way pending things right before they go out, all 20 collections everyday for fashion month. That is the level of dedication heart and soul that goes into that. But what happens is for real people, the democratic public – the people who have a normal amount of money that work everyday, that like nice things, we'll just make these same cuts well by and provide this at a democratic cost. The only thing about it that's different than Nike and Apple is there is never a time when someone can walk in with some non-Nikes and you feel less in yourself [Zane Lowe:] Right [Kanye West:] You still feel like the greatest version of you… [Zane Lowe:] Right [Kanye West:] …when you have those Nikes on, right? But you can have on a ZARA pant, right? [Zane Lowe:] Right [Kanye West:] And a girl walks in with the Celine version, and you feel like sh**. That is the problem. That is the problem [Zane Lowe:] I mean, obviously not my problem because I live like a… [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] I mean, I dress the same way I do it all the 12… [Kanye West:] But I'm talking about, I'm talkin' about us, the new slaves, the people who love fashion. I'm talking about us, you know? Because I'm a slave to it. I love it [Zane Lowe:] Oh, dude, I can tell like… [Kanye West:] I love it! [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] I love it since age five, when my mama brought me to a discount fur spot. And she asked me what I like? Everything I liked was too expensive for us. That's five years old. I went to my grandfather's funeral like three weeks back, and my cousin that works with me, stood up and he told the story about you know, how his mother was a tailor, so he won best dress. I worn best dress in the high school too. A bunch of people in the lineage and my family worn best dress. But his mother was a tailor right? His mother was a tailor, a black, an African-American tailor My grandfather was a hustler. He used to take old vintage furniture and reupholster it. Then he had a store and he sold all of these different items that he thought would be good for people. Do you know how many times I sat with people and said, ‘Hey, I wanna make a store!' And he said, ‘How could you make a store? Blah, blah, blah… It's in my code. It's in my code! Have you all ever seen Wreck-It Ralph?” [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] Remember, remember how that girl in there, the people that was raising here were… [Zane Lowe:] Glitch [Kanye West:] Yeah, she was the glitch [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] You telling me they don't look at me like I'm the motherf**ing glitch? You telling me people don't look at Kanye West like the Glitch? Right now. And she was on the side of the video game, the whole time! It's in my code. It's in my code [Zane Lowe:] I mean, I watch what happens when you get on the mic or you get on stage, and you say what you want to say, and I don't want to refer this back to you comment about the glitch, right. And I watch people, you know, I see what some people say in comments and whatever after these things get posted, and I go, all right, those are the people that think you're the glitch [Kanye West:] Yeah, they broke Vanellope's car! [Zane Lowe:] But, but, but… [Kanye West:] Vanellope Von Schweetz, they broke her car! [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] Like [Zane Lowe:] But there is also a lot of people in the audience that love what you have to say, love hearing what you have to say. You know… [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] …appreciate what you have to say [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] Do you focus on them as well? [Kanye West:] Yeah, 100%. But I'm doing it for everyone. I'm doing it for the people who don't appreciate it because they'll appreciate it later, and of course, I'm doing it for the people who appreciate it. If no one appreciate it, I know, there is couple of people up there to appreciate it [Zane Lowe:] For sure. I appreciate it [Kanye West:] So and thank you very much. And then people will say your voice was so strong, why are you so focused on just clothing or why would you focus on just that award show or why will you focus on that? The same reason why I sat there and focused on that Otis beat You know people didn't like HAM. And Miami Heat was losing and I'm in the Mercer and I literally write on the screen who is watching the Thrones, and show a picture of the brownie stuff. And I'd say I got to watch up Thrones and make Odes, right and say this I know ‘n***as in Paris' doesn't work without Odes. You have to bring the flowers to the door first and we delivered Odes and then we did this So wait a second. That's just a step towards this, because people could say, what do you mean, you want to help the world and you are so concerned about fashion. It's illegal to be naked. It's not illegal to not listen to music. That is a very high opinion to have. That is something that is extremely important. Shoes. You put on shoes everyday. You walking down the street with no shoes, somebody might think there's something wrong with you [Zane Lowe:] Sure [Kanye West:] You're walking down the street without a headphones, it's like, ‘Oh what's up? How you are doing today? No headphones today? Cool! No music today'. What you did, you know. No shoes? ‘Look, man. What's going on? [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] You're having problems with the family?' [Zane Lowe:] Is he okay? [Kanye West:] Wear your socks, at least [Zane Lowe:] Yeah. Sandals [Kanye West:] Sandals. Yeah [Zane Lowe:] Flip-flops, very rarely [Kanye West:] Flip-flops [Zane Lowe:] Very rarely [Kanye West:] Sandals with socks. Keep it gangster [Zane Lowe:] I mean. I'm from New Zealand flip-flops are far more standing [Kanye West:] Yeah, exactly. But not for black dudes, though. No flip-flops for black dudes. I don't care where you at. I don't care where you at. No flip-flop for black dudes. Wear some hot-a** Jordans on a beach [Zane Lowe:] Dude! We've covered some stuff [Kanye West:] What about you? [Zane Lowe:] Now can you do me a favor, like my brain is just like. I walked into his house, two more of the guys there sipping in, man I hope I'll learn some stuff today, my god I have no idea, but would you indulge in me for five or 10 minutes and would you let me just geek out on a music label, because you know me [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] I love hearing what you have to say, some of it I love, some of it upsets me, because as a fan I think you are too out on yourself but that's you, that's who you are, that's not for me to say [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] But… [Kanye West:] What points do you think I'm hard on myself? [Zane Lowe:] Well I think you expect a huge amount of yourself on every level, as well you should and I think that you expect a huge amount of everybody else to understand your motives at all times [Kanye West:] Oh no, I don't expect to be understood at all [Zane Lowe:] Okay, but [Kanye West:] Like I don't expect to be – I think that there's people who are wired by their parents to understand what I'm saying [Zane Lowe:] Sure [Kanye West:] And there's people who are wired by their parents to reject what I'm saying, but that doesn't mean that after I make what I'm saying, that they won't use it, because they will And I'm just saying “I want to make things, I want to be able to make things and I'm not going to be able to make things that I can call Kanye West, just by making T-Shirts, at a certain point it has to connect; “I would not be here if it was not for a Roc a Fella chain If it wasn't for Jay Z's blessing and his co-sign and his protection when I was in New York City, dolo I would not be here in the way that I am. Through the category of the drug dealer filled rap game, me as Kanye West, a young revolutionary coming out of Chicago, would have not made it as far without Jay Z being my big brother and watching my back at all times And this new place that I'm going to and what I want to do it has to be someone that says because I'm – the thing is I'm speaking to everybody, but I'm also speaking and sending queues to the right people to say, “come and help me, help everybody else, you will win with me” you will win [Zane Lowe:] Lets talk about the production side of things, because you've opened the door to collaboration in a big way on this record and even though you produced every song on this record you've been very, very open to the idea of working with all sorts of very talented individuals [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] Have you enjoyed that aspect of it, I mean in the past you know it hasn't necessarily been that much of a group mentality in making records [Kanye West:] It's the only way I can do it at this point. I can't do it by myself, I can't, like I won't, it is – I have no interest in sitting down in the studio by myself and making a track. When I made ‘Overnight Celebrity,' which is great, like; I sat down there by myself and made it. And there's people like, ‘Yeah, that's the answer, make the music by yourself again ‘Ye, we want the old ‘Ye.' But – No, I don't feel like doing that [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] I want to utilize the best resources that we have and have a conversation, as you see I would rather have a conversation [Zane Lowe:] Was ‘Throne' a turning point for that, because I felt I would ‘Throne', there was a freedom there that didn't necessarily feel like you were carrying the whole thing on your own, and also you are free to be an MC, to be upfront and be a part of that process with Jay and it wasn't like oh Kanye the producer rapper or the whole encompa**ing thing. Did that began around that time? [Kanye West:] Yeah around it – but Dark Fantasy though. When we sowed that fabric so tight you know like for eight, nine months Pete Rock, and No I.D., and Q-tip everyone coming down to Hawaii, Nicki Minaj, Rick Ross, we like textured – and Jeff Bhasker we created those textures collectively, you know like I would be eating breakfast with Ross in the morning, and just come up with a line and stuff and we all go play ball and Naz would come out there and play ball with me and Common and stuff, come up with another line, then go there and then Virgil will have a idea we say that and [Darcie] has a idea and like these are really great people that came together to make that and where I – and I learned that process a bit from working on [close], because its that communal process a lot of times [Zane Lowe:] You can't do it all on your own [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] You can't handle everything on your own [Kanye West:] Hey how about us as a people, we can't do it on our own [Zane Lowe:] That's true [Kanye West:] We have to understand that we're not each other's enemy. We have to stop discriminating against each other due to cla** and due to race and due to location or financial position. We have to say “wow that is the best version, lets use it, lets bring it, lets bring it to light, lets move forward, lets push forward as a civilization” because we are so jacked up on our own egos and so misguided by mainstream marketing, we don't know what the f** is real, we would be out again to a fight, this quick for the dumbest reason, definitely something that's like racially, there is a gender set, you know its like, you know which is like we are pitted against each other, we are mentally not in a place to be accepting, to not be jealous and that – part of that jealousy and that frustration that goes across an entire globe is due to some of these other high corporation level limitations, everybody is being served a nasty lunch food. Like you know you heard the word minimalism a lot on this project [Zane Lowe:] Yes of course [Kanye West:] Even this is like, [Kanye sings:] you gave us what you need, may not be what you want, give us what we need to proceed [Zane Lowe:] Not what we necessarily want, because we can't be tested to a certain extent, you know [Kanye West:] Yeah, because we don't have the education [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] To know what to want [Zane Lowe:] Yeah, yeah [Kanye West:] We don't know what to want, this is what I was telling that writer in NW [ph] I'm learning what I want, this is the reason why I'm working at five architects in a time, but that time that I'm spending in a bad apartment, I can't that back, and that education that I could get from working on it is priceless, and there is very few people that are in the position to educate themselves as much as I can educate myself. For me its constant information intake, I hang around architects mostly [Zane Lowe:] Yeah I want to talk about that side of things, because I know that that's how you know that was – that's been talked about in relation to this record as well and that blows my mind, I mean for me I try and connect the dots to my favorite records as much as I can [Kanye West:] Yeah [Zane Lowe:] But I need you to help me connect the dots and how architecture and how certain type of design that you surrounded yourself with Walston Paris has somehow manifested itself into this and how – they are not separate things [Kanye West:] Yeah, it all parallels, its like you know synesthesia seeing sounds, it all parallels. People will tell you this business inst like this business, it's the same people every where you go, the same type of guy you might meet in Hollywood, you might meet that same type of character in fashion, you might meet that same type of character in music You got some straight up people to do it for the love and they want to promote it, its all about that, you got some people that's trying to like make their way, its like – lets just say its 5%, 10%, or 85%ers,and its like there's the 10%ers, the media. For the most part, the 85%ers don't really know what it is. And the 5%ers that know what it is can't get it past the 10%ers So this alone would be a beak, this is a jump past, this going to get taken off the internet quick. [*sounds*] Send the paparazzi at him, send the paparazzi at him lets do that get him locked up blah, blah, blah. That's what's going to happen. And paparazzi is going to come by me, I'm just standing like, I know what you are trying to do right now sir, I know exactly what you are trying to do, somebody sent you at me, somebody is trying to set me up. Somebody is trying to shut me up [Zane Lowe:] You know people will look at what is being going on with you and the cameras, that's been going on with other people for a long time as well and I need you to help people who don't live your life and look at those magazines and there is millions and millions of people that do – and look at those pictures who don't understand what it is that you go through in that situation, what is it from your perspective, you have got this platform, you have used this to talk about a bunch of things, so use it now to explain to them why is it – what is it, what is it like to go through that? [Kanye West:] Okay, for me first of all Dopeness is what I like the most, Dopeness – People who want to make things as dope as possible and by default make money from it The thing I like the least are people who only want to make money from things whether they're dope or not and especially making money at making things as least dope as possible Photography used to be a s**y profession, It was like being a ball player, like a rapper or like a venture capitalist or something like that, right it was they used to get all the girls and everything, like a photographer – you go for a photographer studio like that, they completely changed what photography is supposed to mean, same is how there is like plenty of musicians that have sold the f** out and change like the art and music where people don't hold that to the highest level of genius anymore, meaning like, if there's a high level artist like visual artist or a high level clothing artist, they'll be held at a higher level of genius points than a musician, because the things in music that are selling the most are the least inspired for the most part and the least genius. So, it confuses things. So I take that to paparazzi it confuses it, Paparazzi is necessary, not even a necessary evil, It just needs to be legalized. Meaning at a certain point, there's cutoff switches, you know what time it is, you know what is that. Like Paparazzi currently like is… [Zane Lowe:] Understand, give it rules, give it boundaries [Kanye West:] Yeah and obviously like publishing, like because publishing, like because they're selling our image. And they're selling it in a bad way, and if — [Zane Lowe:] But let me get this straight, what is offending you more, the fact they are selling your image or the fact they are selling your image in a bad way, in a bad way? [Kanye West:] In a bad way, a bad way and I'm not getting paid for it [Zane Lowe:] Right, there you go [Kanye West:] So it's like the dopeness which makes the money, I want the dopeness and the money [Zane Lowe:] Yeah [Kanye West:] I'm changing things for my daughter. I'm going to tell my daughter, by the time she understands what it was, Man, me and your mother were in a completely different situation than you're in. At that time, Paparazzi wasn't legal, people could take pictures, people could climb over your fence, people could do that you wouldn't even get paid for it. You see all these checks that you're getting at age six, because people taking your picture? You don't have to worry about thing, a thing ever again just because people want to take your picture, like and I made that happen, Lowe. That's what I'm going to tell her [Zane Lowe:] So [touring] to be done, oh I want to talk to you about control, I want talk to you about the verse and control. About Kendrick verse and ‘Control'. Because obviously he credited you, he put you at the table where he rightfully should be with the M&Ms and the Jay Z's, he put you on that side of the equation and then and then raddled off the list and I thought okay its great you deserved to be at the table, but 10 years ago if you hadn't been at the table and you had been on his list, how do you think you would have reacted, would you have been appreciative of his message or would you have come out swinging do you think and written a response? [Kanye West:] Yeah I don't diss records [Zane Lowe:] Yeah, yeah. You are looking forward to two with him; I mean that's an incredible double bill [Kanye West:] Yeah its 100%, its 100%. I'm just looking forward to the opportunity to speak to this brother as much as possible. That – those conversations is going to be more than everything I even say it right here. Because that he is one of our future messengers and I'm going to give him them j**els [Zane Lowe:] Let's talk about this track here, which was the first track that we were given off this album to play on the radio which we did. He said no singles, but we ran with this one early and we proven to be right. So just talk about this track here and who you worked with, you worked with Daft Punk on this in part, and how the song came together? [Kanye West:] Daft had the drums, and I then just took the reck and I just started, both this song, ‘I Am a God' and this song were made after Hedi Slimane didn't let me into his first Saint Laurent show, but it wasn't that – he wanted me to go, but he just told me I couldn't go to any other shows other than that [Zane Lowe:] Right, right, right, right [Kanye West:] And I was like, wait a second. I can't go? You're not telling no editor they can't go to any of these shows. I'm not your boy you can control me in some way. So I made – off of that, I went into the studio with the producers that made the music for his show and made ‘I Am a God' and ‘Black Skinhead.' [Zane Lowe:] That was your reaction to that situation again [Kanye West:] That was my reaction [Zane Lowe:] That was the aspect of frustration you talked about that's important to this record [Kanye West:] Yes [Zane Lowe:] Yeah right on. I mean just talking about another track on here as well. New Slaves which is one of my favorite songs on the record and you know its just as far as beats go its just remarkable, before you even get stuck into the subject matter which is a whole other level. I mean you know you are talking about the materialism, about communist, about corporations and everything else, but at the same time you know there is a blurred line between whether or not you are part of it, whether you are objecting to it or where it stands. I mean just give us some insight into what this song is [Kanye West:] I'm 100% a part of it, I'm 100% in it, and 100% I want to over come it, sometimes I'm the communicator of it, some times I'm the maker of it, some times I'm the consumer of it, I'm in it, I'm in the game. But for me – yeah I say I am a New Slave, you could be a slave to a lot of things At this point obviously I'm a slave to my pa**ion; I'm a slave to my mission. It's funny; you drive in a Maybach past a homeless person and you ask Who's more free? You could be trapped to your possessions. You got to do this next deal because you got to do this with your house and you got to get this car and you got to keep up, everybody stay next to you last name is Jones, and you trying to keep up with all of them. And that's what it's like to be a celebrity a lot times Especially every rap is about how much money you make how many spends you get, how many cars you got, what house you get, you know what house A Rock got. We like you know Rappers and musicians trying to compete with ball players with way bigger contracts. Meanwhile, the music is the Titanic that's going down like this and everybody from the execs to the musicians are running around trying to see how they could still keep that certain house level, that certain car level that certain thing – up And of course for me I'm blessed and I'm blessed and I'm privileged because I made such a powerful impact that I can make a certain amount on tour. But also I'm blessed and cursed by my level of education, you know to be a visionary, all you have to do is make decisions based off of your eyes instead of your ears and your memory. I mean so at the moment of the MTV awards, I made that decision based off of my eyes: I was like, that's not correct, that is invalid, completely invalid. And everybody else don't move, that's off they ears. Oh, he going to get in trouble. That's off they memory. They don't move. They're slaved, they're slave to what could possibly happen, we are constantly slaved, there is gla** ceilings, there is gla** fences, there is invisible walls, don't think I have not been many a' times singing like five heart beats in Paris, I have been up there singing, you want to diss one of my outfits, don't want to say that, don't want to like try to diss one of my girlfriends outfits blah, blah We are just singing, y'all sing aintcha? we can come out of that totally Yea we sing aintcha? Sing something here. And what do we sing? We sing Pyrex, we sing Beentrill, we sing Snapbacks, we sing Yeezus but we want to sing that Nike, we want that clean water, I tasted and I see what it is like, we want to sing Louis Vuitton, we want to sing on a Gucci level, we want to sing as high as we could when we have Pyramids, we don't want to just have a little print on the back of our jacket that costs $2000, making us feel like a king again for a day We don't want to just have j**elry that's just trying to make us feel good, we want to be good. That's creation, that's that thing that people slave over. That's that thing that people are slaves to. That's that thing that I'm a slave to. That's pa**ion, That's that thing where you can hold it. That's that dreaming of a new pair of Jordans. That's the process of opening up a Nike box. That thing that Steve gave us when you open up your new iPhone and you got the iPhone5 whether you stood in line for it or whatever it is you did or stuff, but you open it up, and you got this new product That's that Transformers in a box that you open up for Christmas or that new TurboGrafx16 or Sega Genesis or Amiga computer or a 3DO or a Nintendo or it's like when you just open that packaging. The process of the packaging, that's that p**no mag that drug addict bought for you when you was 14 that was in that package and you figured out how to pay that drug dealer before there was internet to buy you – and you open up that and you know you are going to make 5 of those your girlfriend all weekend. That's why I'm on that runway, until I'm at the end of it [Zane Lowe:] [ ] Good luck [Kanye West:] Thanks [Zane Lowe:] All right, thank you crew [Kanye West:] Thank you [Zane Lowe:] Oh my god, that was the most intense f**ing interview in my life [Kanye West:] [That's it ( ) right here]